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How much spark strengthe is needed for Alky?
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Glen
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PostPosted: Tue, Dec 08 2015, 11:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know if It will work but I don't see the power grid mentioned above.

I run it with the 7720 box for 220 Millijoules and the red HVC II coil part nuber 8261.
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Beck
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PostPosted: Wed, Dec 09 2015, 9:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glen wrote:
I don't know if It will work but I don't see the power grid mentioned above.

I run it with the 7720 box for 220 Millijoules and the red HVC II coil part nuber 8261.

This needs to run through a distributor, right?
That is what I am trying to eliminate.
A distributor will not clear my intake.

MSD 7720 ------- $400
MSD 7730 ------- $360
MSD 8261 ------- $180
Total ------------- $940

"Speed costs $$$. How fast you want to go?"
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Glen
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PostPosted: Wed, Dec 09 2015, 10:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry i.missed that
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kb426
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PostPosted: Wed, Dec 09 2015, 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Beck, I looked at pics of the engine as produced. The distributor is the same as a 4 cyl. chevy. Are you not able to use the original location?
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Beck
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PostPosted: Wed, Dec 09 2015, 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kb426 wrote:
Beck, I looked at pics of the engine as produced. The distributor is the same as a 4 cyl. chevy. Are you not able to use the original location?

I had to double check. I put the dizzy in a bare block and put my head and intake on it. The intake clears the dizzy and the cap, but the plug boots do NOT clear the #1 intake tube. I need 1/2".

Even if it all fit. I don't think I would trust the ignition system for blown alcohol. I have a distributor converted to HEI, but even that won't be good enough. It has the little cap (Vega). If I was making enough spark it would arc in the cap.
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Beck
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PostPosted: Wed, Dec 09 2015, 10:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Close but no cigar.


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chimp koose
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PostPosted: Wed, Dec 09 2015, 11:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why not run the bare dizzy w/o cap or rotor and use it as just a trigger for the distributorless system
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Beck
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PostPosted: Thu, Dec 10 2015, 8:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

chimp koose wrote:
Why not run the bare dizzy w/o cap or rotor and use it as just a trigger for the distributorless system

My understanding of the distributorless systems is not very good.
I have looked at 2 MSD systems. DIS-2 / DIS-4 Plus and the 6214 Midget Racing. The DIS systems want a DIS input.I don't know what kind of a signal that is, other than it comes from the ECU. The 6214 wants a non magnetic input (flying magnet). The only thing I know to put in the distributor is a magnetic pickup coil. That signal is not compatable??
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chimp koose
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PostPosted: Thu, Dec 10 2015, 11:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

what if you press fit an aluminum plate onto the distributor shaft with 4 equally spaced magnets on it . you could then put the non magnetic pickup on the distributor body to get the signal . You would still need to program the ignition curve , unless you could mount the pickup to the advance mechanism in the distributor body.
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Beck
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PostPosted: Thu, Dec 10 2015, 1:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chimp koose wrote:
what if you press fit an aluminum plate onto the distributor shaft with 4 equally spaced magnets on it . you could then put the non magnetic pickup on the distributor body to get the signal . You would still need to program the ignition curve , unless you could mount the pickup to the advance mechanism in the distributor body.

There is a MAJOR 2nd benefit from NO distributor at all. I cannot get a billet roller cam made with the distributor drive gear on it. I MUST remove the distributor to swap to a roller cam. Since the distributor drives the oil pump it also requires and external oil pump.

That is a good idea! Your suggestion is just a little off. There needs to be just one magnet on the distributor shaft plate and 2 non magnetic pickup coils on the body.

That takes the flying magnet off of the balancer. Initially the pickups would need to be checked to make sure they were in sync. The pickups would move together when the distributor body is rotated. The only problem I see is with the small diameter plate for the magnet some accuracy may be lost.

This still requires external electronics. I still like the MSD 6214 for this setup for a mechanical injection. It could also feed a Megasquirt efi.

This same idea would work for some of the other controllers. I could mount a small 60-2 wheel for the plate and use the appropriate pickups. This would work with the Electromotive TECs I've been researching.
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Beck
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PostPosted: Thu, Dec 10 2015, 2:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Beck wrote:

This same idea would work for some of the other controllers. I could mount a small 60-2 wheel for the plate and use the appropriate pickups. This would work with the Electromotive TECs I've been researching.

NOPE that won't work. It would need to be a 120(-4) tooth wheel.
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enjenjo
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PostPosted: Thu, Dec 10 2015, 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MSD offers a universal crank trigger wheel that can have two pickups installed for your 6214 application. It seems to me that this would be the way to go. You would just need to fabricate a ring to hold the pickups.

http://www.msdignition.com/Products/Crank_Triggers/Crank_Triggers/8655_ -_Universal_Crank_Trigger_Kit.aspx

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Beck
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PostPosted: Thu, Dec 10 2015, 7:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

enjenjo wrote:
MSD offers a universal crank trigger wheel that can have two pickups installed for your 6214 application. It seems to me that this would be the way to go. You would just need to fabricate a ring to hold the pickups.

http://www.msdignition.com/Products/Crank_Triggers/Crank_Triggers/8655_ -_Universal_Crank_Trigger_Kit.aspx

I think the MSD 8640 is a better buy. The wheel is already set up for my balancer (SBF). The bracket won't fit but it would need fabrication on either. The pricing is $15 less with less work.

http://www.msdignition.com/Products/Crank_Triggers/Crank_Triggers/8640_ -_Ford_Small_Block_Crank_Trigger_Kit.aspx
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enjenjo
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PostPosted: Thu, Dec 10 2015, 7:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That would be a better deal. I was not sure that the damper was the same as any thing else.

I would still make the pickup holder as a ring, so you could change both pickup positions at the same time without having to retime them to each other.

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Beck
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PostPosted: Fri, Dec 18 2015, 2:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I also posted about this on my Mechanical or EFI injection thread.

I have decided to use the Holley HP EFI unit. It includes ignition. All the engine management gets bundled into one package. My application will eliminate the distributor. The motor will use a 60-2 crank wheel for triggering.

I do have a couple options for ignition using that system. I can run a wasted spark system (DIS) or a coil per cylinder system. I could get by without a cam position sensor with the wasted spark, but I would also not have sequential injector firing then.

I picked up a LS truck "round" coil pack last night at the recyclers. I can fire 2 coils at once with the wasted spark, or individually if I install the cam position sensor.
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